Ep 029: Amir Hamja

A SHOT: To start, can you describe the photo that we’re going to talk about?
AMIR HAMJA: The photo we are talking about today is about a family who is from Palestine, and they’re currently living in Springfield, New Jersey. This story is about Adam and Ola Abo Sheriah, who lost nearly 200 family members in Gaza during this war. I was assigned by one of our New York Times photo editors to photograph this story, which was written by my colleague Anna Betts, and the [photo] editor was Dubravka Bondulic. 

What sort of preparation do you do beforehand? How much are you able to learn about the story? Is there anything you’re trying to find out?
Every story has a different kind of preparation. If the story’s a portrait assignment… For example, [NBA player] Chris Paul, I did a photograph of him in Midtown [Manhattan] but I knew it was only gonna be a 10-minute shoot. I would love to have different looks on it, so if I have an option, I will always go to have a scout day to see how the location looks and figure out where I can set up if I want to use a backdrop or not, what kind of light I’m using, or use natural light. These factors are there for technical purposes, so I can [be ready to shoot] as soon as possible once we get on set. Other than that, I always try to read about the subject or the story — what is going on, what kind tone it’s gonna be. Is it a heavy story? Is it a joyful story? Is it style desk? Is it arts-and-culture desk? Is this breaking news? All these factors, you just prepare so differently. 

For this one, I think that week I was working on a few other stories, so I had less time to prepare. But Anna was already on this for a while, so I got a brief idea from her what the story’s about. Also, I got a sense of it because the war is still going on, so I knew it was gonna be a very sensitive story, and I really would love to be part of this story that I would love to tell. 

How do you get ready on the day that you know you’re going to be making this image?
In the night before, I make sure all my camera, lenses — anything that needs to be checked — everything is prepared, batteries charged. Because of the nature of this story, I knew we were gonna spend a day with this family, so there are going to be a lot of candid moments as it goes. It’s going to be a very natural, documentary style of photography. So I was mentally prepared the kind of lens I was going to use and how it was going to be, not intruding that much in their space. It’s going to be more fly-on-the-wall. So I was mentally ready that way. And I knew that a few portraits might be taken, so I was also prepared for that. But as we were on the go, I’d figure it out. So mainly it was mentally preparation, I would say. 

Is there anything that you remember about the day you shot this?
We went to their house at, like, 7 AM. We went pretty early so we can start catching up from Adam dropping his kid to the school, following him everywhere, but pretty much his work, his home, all aspects of his daily life in New Jersey. In Adam’s store, one of his clients was a regular client at his pharmacy. Adam runs a pharmacy in Patterson [New Jersey]. A few years ago, during COVID, Adam’s father was there, at the pharmacy. She talked with his father, and she knew that his father visited the US sometimes from Gaza. At this time, I was able to take portraits of Adam outside of his store. I was asking him, “Come with me. I’ll take a portrait.” While I was going, I see that client of his stop him, like, “How is your father doing? I haven’t seen him in a long time,” some questions about the whereabouts of his father. And he couldn’t tell her that his father had been killed. What he does is he points to one of his colleagues, like, “Can you take care of her? She will tell you about my father,” or something like that. Then I take him outside to take the portraits. Once a portrait is done, I come back with him. In between that time, his colleague already briefed her that his father had been killed in the war, so once she sees him back, she actually hugs him and consoles him. By that moment, I already knew this is a photo. This is really a photo for this story. That was one of the moments I cannot miss. I was already taking the photos, and then I tapped my writer, like, “You should talk to this person. She’s very important to the story.” 

Because it’s really in-the-moment, whatever you have, you’re gonna take the photo with, no doubt about it. I think I had a 35mm lens with me, and you can see a little bit of the store. Because I was taking the portrait, I didn’t have the widest lens on, but when you see this kind of moment, you don’t hesitate. Whatever you have, you just take the photo. I wish I had a 24mm at that time. It would have been different, but I would have loved to give a sense of the whole space of the pharmacy. It would have been great, I think. 

What’s your setup specifically for this photo of him with his wife?
This is [a] 24-70mm [lens], wider. Or maybe 24mm. Something wide, for sure. I wanted to have where they live because they’re sitting next to a wall that could be anywhere. It could be a tight frame, the way it’s cropped, but I wanted to see a traditional New Jersey home and suburban house, which gives a sense that they’re not in Gaza or elsewhere. You can tell that this is an American household. For that reason, I wanted to see more of the space. 

So you spent a lot of time with them on this day. The story that you were telling about him working at the pharmacy, is that before or after this photo?
It’s after this photo. You can tell that every day they’ve been hearing all this sad news after 100 calls talking to their family, but still they have to live their normal life, go back to work. So that’s also how we thought about it: They’re living a normal life. We want to see it. 

This photo on the couch then, how quickly do you take this photo?
When we entered the house, I sat down exactly where I was taking the photo from, opposite the couch. It’s around 9 or 10 AM. By that time, they’d both been trying to reach their family in Gaza. They’d been trying nonstop. After a long time, she got ahold of her sister. And her sister got ran over by…got injured somehow while getting aid. She started crying on the phone. While he was on the phone, you could see she slowly started breaking down while talking to the reporter. He comes in slowly to console her. At this point I know, “Okay, I have to take my photos silently,” because I don’t want to interrupt while she was talking to my reporter. While she’s crying and being that emotional, I don’t want her to hear a clicking sound nonstop. So I went into silent mode and [shot] more from my hip so she doesn’t feel like I’m putting the camera on my face, just being respectful of her space and the distance between me and her. 

Outside of that, were there any challenges in making this image, anything you might have found yourself fighting against or maybe something you just had to think a little more about?
When I’m in a situation like this, photographing people in vulnerable situations, you must question how close is too close. I remember, I was photographing in 2017 in a Rohingya camp. I don’t know if you remember when Rohingya Myanmar refugees were coming to Bangladesh. A huge influx of Rohingya refugees were coming to our side of the country, so I went to one of the refugee camps to photograph. A lot of injured people, and there’s an old woman. She’s crying for food or something, and I just go close [to take a picture]. Over the years I learned that was not a good way to do it. So whenever this situation comes up, you need to have a sense of understanding how close you should be, not too close that you’re intruding her space, being respectful and, at least, also giving humility so it doesn’t feel like I’m intruding her privacy in a way, so she doesn’t feel uncomfortable. Those things, mentally, you’re making sure you’re not crossing that limit or line when you’re taking this kind of photograph. 

How would you describe how they’re both regarding you within this, while you were taking it?
As a brown person, as a Muslim, one of the first things we talked about when we introduced ourselves… Anna had talked with Adam before, but I never got to talk with Adam, so this was the first time we were meeting. When I saw him, he asked me where I’m from, so I told, “I’m from Bangladesh.” It was so easy to blend with them because we have so much similarities as Muslims, also culturally. A lot of things are common between us because of religion, because of how we look. My mom pretty much dresses up like her — exactly like her, honestly — in the home. So it was very familiar visuals for me. I think they also felt the same way. 

Do you think there’s anything you had access to because you had that connection?
I believe so. It helps, no doubt. There’s one photo I took while Ola was watching the news on the TV, what’s happening in Gaza, and her daughter starts playing in front of her on the floor. I actually went back behind her so, in the foreground, I can see her head and so that I can see the news, and I can also see that her kids are playing. I wanted to have this whole scene, but her couch is literally in the wall. There’s no space. So I’m literally almost behind her body, like crouching over, and take the photo, which is… I feel like because we had this already, we talked a lot throughout the day. We talked about food. She was making iftar, so we talked about what iftar we used to make, or what she’s making, what’s common between us. We already had good bonding over the time, so it was easy for me to make this move, which doesn’t feel like I’m intruding. At this point, I believe we had a mutual understanding that we can get along so that we can make these photos. 

I find it interesting you mentioning the layering that you’re trying in that other photo. The photos that you made during the George Floyd protests were a bit of a breakthrough for you. And I often see you return to that style of working, where you’re finding the layering within the density of a crowd. How do you find yourself thinking about and approaching an assignment like this, and particularly this picture, when there’s not necessarily a crowd to work from within?
I try to have some kind of layers in the photos so it has the feeling of different dynamics. I always try to add elements as much as I can in the foreground, background. But this one, it’s their story, so I was more focused on them for sure. And when the moment came when I can see she started to cry… There’s a series of photos: I have a photo of her crying while Adam is still on the phone, then he comes close, then he gets off his phone and starts consoling her, and then, after, a photo where her daughter comes with a tissue and gives it to her. I have a series of photos going all the way down. For me that moment was very important already, but I wanted to also show the layers of this house so I could have a sense of space and place. So I was trying to play with the layers, even though it’s a very simple photo with two linear lines. I was trying to get just a little bit of a sense of the depth of the space. Because of the story, it’s really important that they live there now. This is their home now. And they’re still going through this tough time, and they’re telling us the story. They’re being vulnerable in front of us in that home. 

What do you like about how much you can see of their house from where they’re sitting?
The main reason was the sofa they’re sitting on, it was right next to the window, and the light was hitting. Also when you entered into the house, Adam sat on that side. I think it’s very natural of us to sit on the other side so we can talk to them. It was their decision to sit on that side. As a photographer, I don’t want to stage anything. I’m gonna go as it is, as a fly on the wall. I’m not gonna change anything at this point. But I want to change the position I’m in. The composition was tight enough to show their face and their emotion and, at the same time, show their house, too. 

You mentioned that you didn’t want to change anything or alter anything. How do you recognize that that’s what’s required of the way that you’re working? It would very easy to, say, if he sits down in a spot where the light just isn’t right, and you’re like, “Oh, maybe you could switch over here, and we can talk?”
Sometimes that can happen, but this moment, as it was happening, they’d already started talking about their family. For me it felt like, I don’t want to change the position just for a photo at the moment. At least they’re being comfortable in this space, and I can see this working for me. It doesn’t feel right, with this kind of story that I’m covering, to really stage that much. It would be better to stay authentic to the story. It’s the photojournalist’s job to be truthful to the story. If it was some portrait shoot, only portraits, then I can change or make him sit in a better light. That’s a different case. But this is a story about documenting the whole day with them. I have to be honest in every possible way. 

Throughout the entire day, you worked that way?
Yeah, totally. Any photojournalism, staging is not allowed. In The New York Times we have our own ethical set of rules. Anyone can read it. 

So how are you considering the light when making this photo?
For this one, I knew that I’m going to follow them throughout the day. I don’t want to use any artificial light or adding any light. It could be distracting. It was clear from the beginning that I’m following them, and it’s gonna be very candid and spontaneous. I don’t want to carry a light that distracts them. I honestly didn’t need it for the story. Only if I needed to do a portrait, if I’m doing a better portrait with different lights maybe. But not for this ongoing story that I see. It doesn’t require a light. So when they sat down and I saw the light is falling from the window… That’s their morning every day. This is the truth. I’m glad that I had this spot, and where they’re sitting totally worked for me. It was natural light, and it worked. 

Is there anything that you have to think of technically when you know you’re going to be working that way, whether it’s making sure you can push your ISO or shoot a little more wide open?
At this point, with these new mirrorless cameras, things have changed. You can shoot really dark and pull the exposure a little bit up. You can see a lot of details there too. It’s changed a lot, so any place there’s a good amount of light, you can really work on it with natural light. 

So I went to journalism school and one of the lessons that was hammered into us at least 20 years ago when I was there was understanding the idea of maintaining objectivity when you’re reporting. How are you considering those sorts of principles of journalism when making a photo like this?
Just going with our ethical standard and all the very basic ethical journalism that you follow, that any photojournalist would follow: not to fake anything, not to stage anything. You just show the honesty and truthfulness with the humanity in every possible way. 

How much of a place is there for empathy when making a photo like this? And there is room for that, while you’re working, where do you think we can see that in this photo?
You can see there’s empathy in this photo. A husband is consoling his wife. There’s always room for empathy in any story, in any photos. For a job, if you’re a photojournalist, you have to do your job, and empathy will also be there. You cannot be human without empathy. As a photojournalist, your job is to document everything in the most honest possible way, and you cannot detach from the truth in any degree. You can always see empathy in photojournalism for sure. 

It’s there in presenting the vulnerability.
Yes.

There’s ways of photographing people… I just went to the photo show that’s up right now of Bruce Gilden’s photos, and he’s taken incredible photos, but he’s a very angry photographer. So someone like that might look at this and see the redness in her nose and cheeks and be like, “What a dynamic moment! Let’s get in there.” Whereas that might not have empathy for the situation?
This is the 100 percent truth that I saw. I happened to be there photographing it and happened to witness it, and I saw it through my camera 100 percent like that. It shows everything that’s supposed to be shown. So I’m glad that I took it in the most honest way. 

If you’re in a situation like this and, say, she had started crying, but she didn’t have a tissue with her, and you had a box of tissues next to you, do you hand her the tissues?
No. I have to do my job. If I give the tissues to her, to some degree I’m altering the space I’m in. I don’t want to do that.

So you’re headed home after making these photos, what then comes next?
We go back. I edit the photos the way I would want the tone or color correction, anything that needed to be done. I do a broad range of edit and send them to the editors. After that, the editors take over, and they decide the photos that are going to be in the article. 

Was this a photo that you knew would be part of the story, just in your sense of this one’s important?
Definitely. But I didn’t expect it was going to be the front page. It was not in my expectation that, “Oh, I’m gonna see this on the front page.” But I definitely knew that photo was one of the moments that I got there. It was something that would be part of the story. 

What does this photo tell that the rest of the photos don’t tell?
For me, this photo captured the humanity and all the emotions and the situation, how sad or… Even though it’s only two people, it also tells the story that it’s two families who are losing hundreds of members in Gaza. It invites you to a bigger story to read. 

I couldn’t help but think the setting for this photo is so important because it’s very clear that there’s space for other people. 
Yeah. I’m pretty sure if I saw this photo from another photographer, I would click on it to see what’s happening. For that reason, it was more inviting. I think it was quite fitting to start with. 

For sure. It doesn’t answer any questions. 
Yes, it makes you curious to look at more of what’s happening. 

Did anything about this photo in particular surprise you when you found it in the edit and submitted it?
I was surprised seeing that photo as the lead and that photo also on the front page. I knew that this was an important photo for sure. That’s why I think you need a photo editor to work on your photos other than you being there. Sometimes you think very literal, but a photo editor always sees it in a different light. They have a great vision. They know what’s fit for print, what fits for online. They know this better than photographers. When I was shooting, there was one photo I took of Adam. He was driving back home from his daughter’s school when he dropped her off. And I have a photo of him driving, so you can see the view: He’s in driving mode, and I can see the side view and the sun flickering in the morning light. For me, it felt like a very cinematic photo, and it could be a lead photo. In my head: “Okay, it could be the opening photo!” But that’s not how it works. And the editor made the best decision. 

For sure. A photo editor provides that person who wasn’t there. 
I think they can read the story better with your photos when they’re not there. They’re also trying to get the story through your photos. They see it as outside of your point of view, while you were there, and you’re personally attached to everything that you saw. You’re like, “Oh, my gosh. I should have this.”

It’s almost the same thing: One time way before, I went to this festival and I wanted to take this photo. So I walked up 14 floors of a building and took this photo from the rooftop, and it was such hard work to go there and take the photo. But for an editor, it might have been nothing because she didn’t see the hard work that I did. But I was emotionally attached, like, “Okay I did the hard work. It should be the photo.” But I’m glad that editors work on the photos. 

It’s such an interesting way that we work because you know the 15 minutes that came before this photo and you know the 15 minutes that came after this photo, and it’s difficult to remove them from your mind because you were even saying this is part of a series where he might have leaned in a little bit more, someone came into the frame, his phone was down, that kind of thing. You’re working for The New York Times for this. Was that a new feeling in how you were working — of having people you could trust to find the photo that does say it all?
Yeah, throughout the whole New York Times fellowship, I got to see them often in the office. So it was more familial bonding with them rather than always working with only e-mails, and we never see the editors. I think the first two years I worked without seeing any editors because of COVID and other things. So it was a different experience because I was a part of… I could have called them my colleagues at that point and see them and talk to them. I could ask them at the desk what story they’re working on. “Can I be part of this story?” It was a more open space for me. I definitely had a lot of trust for the editors after this whole experience. 

You made this image closer to the end of your New York Times fellowship than to the beginning. What do you think you learned with regard to making this photo that you wouldn’t have known at the start of your time there?
The way I take photos stayed the same. But before, as a freelancer, you only took the photos and sent them. You did your job. Now I know the writer works on it, and then photo editors work on it. Then a designer works on it. It’s a lot of processes that finally go to where you see the final piece. Now, every time I take photos I keep those things in mind, that there’s a lot of other people working on it, so I need to be respectful. Now I really do want to do better because I know how many people are working on it. Not only as a photographer do I have to do good for myself, I also have to think about the writer that’s putting in so much effort. Anyone who’s working, they want that piece to look beautiful, too. It’s not only me wanting my photo to look good. They want their piece looking at their best, too. Also, same goes to the designer who’s designing the front page. I’m really working with a lot of people. It should be teamwork. I need to do my best. That didn’t come to me before the fellowship. I never thought about it that way. 

What do you think we can learn about you from the choices you’ve made specifically with this photo?
I think it can give the sense that I’m able to humanize the situation without disrupting the elements in the photo, and I still can go tell the story the most human way possible. 

Do you think that having the experience and the reps of doing a story like this affects how you shoot other things?
The way I think about how I work: There’s a story that you do for money. An assignment comes up; I need the assignment because I have bills to pay. Then there’s a story where you want to feed your craft because you have this hunger for the craft that you love. Then, as a photographer, you love to want to be part of doing important work. That’s how you feel good about yourself. It’s like having this hunger not for the money or other things. It’s to satisfy yourself. “I have to believe in this story; I want to be a part of the story.” It’s something built-in as a photographer. Also, this is why I love doing photography because you always end up meeting so many different kinds of people and get to know their stories, step into their lives. It’s just different. I think this is one of the best parts of being a photographer. You just get to know a lot of different parts of people’s lives. 

This one time I used to work for this real-estate company. This is way back, when I was kind of trying to survive. I used to cover 10–12 apartments in a day in the Upper West Side, the Bronx, everywhere. Even though it was such low pay, I really loved doing it. The first thing I loved about it: It used to take me to every neighborhood I would never go. I would go to the deep Bronx. Sometimes I would go the Upper West Side in some fancy apartment. Every time I walked in, it’s a different space. I loved the fact that I was walking into somebody’s life. Sometimes it’s an empty apartment. Then I see outside, what does the outside look like? I always used to sit down and think, “This is interesting.” Then I’d see how people decorate their stuff. Someone is an artist. Or one was a lawyer’s house, or some finance people’s apartment. Even though it was such low pay, I enjoyed doing it because I had to go into different people’s lives in a different way. That’s why I love photography, doing so many different kind of things. That’s why I think when this kind of story comes, you really want a part of it because you feel this is a very important story to tell and you want to be a team-player on the story. At the same time, you do a five-minute shoot, portrait shoots, you love the craft and you want to be better and better. It’s a mix of feelings. 

Interviewed on July 22, 2024.
(This transcript has been edited for brevity.)

Links:
Amir Hamja
The New York Times: ” ‘It’s Just Agony’: A Suburban Family Mourns Nearly 200 Relatives”